Quote but it's perfect for word processing or note taking
You must be on drugs Keither, that's the only explanation. This thing is well beyond horrid for word processing and it's barely acceptable for note taking.
It might be almost ok for light sketching, a replacement for napkins. But on that front it would do a hell of a lot better if they teamed up with Wacom and their Cintiq technology. Then it actually would be an impressive, revolutionary device. But Apple doesn't do revolutionary, they only do pretty.
I totally agree. I am a music pastor for churches. This would be a great thing to put on stage and access the thousands of songs I would want to pull from as well.
Many niches could be found and I don't think Apple is limiting itself. I think people haven't realized what doors this thing is opening up.
Sidenote, your response just gave me a great idea: An iPhone/iTouch instrument mount for the standard lyre music adapter. Same idea as yours, just attached to the instruments for marching! :-D
I was under the impression that you still need a computer to dock this with iTunes, and sync music/movies/apps/documents/etc. So, you're saying that people without serious computer needs would buy a computer AND an iPad (for when they aren't sitting next to the computer)?
*Unless the iPhone OS gained the ability to do all this stuff without syncing to iTunes and no one told me.
You don't need to sync to anything to load content onto an iPhone and I expect the iPad; You can download directly from Apple to the device via the iTunes App.
Of course it would be more then a little bit risky to not sync it with a computer based iTunes, if only for backup reasons. I don't think anyone is suggesting that the iPad can realistically live without a real computer around somewhere, at least not for very long. For instance you can't do OS upgrades without a real computer iTunes.
True. Folks didn't appreciate how truly different the iPod was and how it would turn out to be a game changer.
I think this is a bit different, since this product is more evolutionary than revolutionary. It is basically a giant iPod Touch/iPhone. This is both an advantage and disadvantage. Disadvantage in that some technophiles are disappointed it isn't more of a breakthrough device with totally new capabilities. But also an advantage, since lots of folks already use iphones and like their apps, which can work on this new device.
So, I do think some folks are underestimating them, and I think Apple will sell lots of them, especially the lower price WiFi only ones. At $499, I can see lots of folks picking one up as a second or third way of accessing the internet at home. Though who knows how the recession may factor into this. And I can imagine them being used in a school/business setting (college textbook reader, data slate for doctors, etc).
The one deal breaker for me is lack of support for Adobe Flash. As I mentioned before, the lack of multitasking was also a disappointment, but I could live without that and can see how running just one app at a time has benefits in terms of ease of use for the tech novices (no need to manage different windows, or remember to shut down processes).
Apple hates Flash and is trying to kill it. It hates it because it doesn't control the code and also because Flash is a resource hog and doesn't run as well as it could on Mac (though part of this is Apple's fault for not working with Adobe). It wants to move the Web ecosystem to HTML 5 and other open standards (which it doesn't control but can adapt). In the short term, however, this screws the consumer. Lots of people will be disappointed the first time they try to access Netflix, Hulu, etc., on their IPad and get a big fat FAIL. Eventually, these sites may start either create apps (like Youtube) for accessing the videos or stream video using an HTML 5 player (again, Youtube is experimenting with this). But Flash is still ubiquitous on the web, and even if other tech is going to win out, it's going to be a long time until Flash is not essential for having the total Web experience.
Quote Bored of watching the full iPad keynote? No problem! The following video by Neil Curtis sums it up to convenient 180 seconds of all the important words spoken there. I assure you, that no scene is repeated and everything was said on this keynote! Oh, and please don't take it personal: it's meant to be humor!
Quote Apple hates Flash and is trying to kill it. It hates it because it doesn't control the code and also because Flash is a resource hog and doesn't run as well as it could on Mac (though part of this is Apple's fault for not working with Adobe). It wants to move the Web ecosystem to HTML 5 and other open standards (which it doesn't control but can adapt). In the short term, however, this screws the consumer. Lots of people will be disappointed the first time they try to access Netflix, Hulu, etc., on their IPad and get a big fat FAIL. Eventually, these sites may start either create apps (like Youtube) for accessing the videos or stream video using an HTML 5 player (again, Youtube is experimenting with this). But Flash is still ubiquitous on the web, and even if other tech is going to win out, it's going to be a long time until Flash is not essential for having the total Web experience.
That's interesting. When I first heard it wouldn't have flash, I assumed it was because of whatever reason the Pre doesn't either (which I have no idea). But in the case of the Pre I keep hearing someday they may add a patch to allow it. Guess that won't happen with the iPad if what you're saying is true.
Side question: Regarding Flash, I noticed a while ago that Hulu runs better if I'm using Safari than if I'm using Firefox (specifically when I'm watching full screen). If the issue was Apple not liking it, wouldn't it make more sense for that to be the other way around?
Quote Side question: Regarding Flash, I noticed a while ago that Hulu runs better if I'm using Safari than if I'm using Firefox (specifically when I'm watching full screen). If the issue was Apple not liking it, wouldn't it make more sense for that to be the other way around?
It's not Safari being good with Flash, it's Firefox being bad. Specifically the new tab sessions saving feature which takes a snapshot of all your tabs every 10 seconds. With a lot of tabs open and/or slower hard disk write speeds, it causes a very noticeable pause or stutter.
That helped me a lot, but not completely. I think I just run too many developer debugging plugins and such that bloat down FireFox. I run Hulu in Chrome now.
Re Flash on i(Things). Similar to disallowing multi-tasking, there is much more to it then the official explainations (battery life, etc). That's not an excuse when the device is plugged in and it would be easy to make it aware of the current power source (much like all modern laptops currently do).
The thing is, if you allow multi-tasking...if you allow flash...if you allow bluetooth keyboards... It quickly becomes easy to see how an iPhone/iTouch (much less an iPad) could replace at least one of a household's real computers. It would also be a huge threat to Apple TV.
The computing power of these phone size devices really is enough now to start fully replacing a number of the larger and much more expensive computers in our life. But that's not good business...especially for a company that makes most of its money with those larger, expensive computers. So they have to artificially restrict what it can do or else they shoot themselves in the foot.
Yeah. I agree that part of the banning Flash thing is protecting their business lines. Not just in terms of overlap with laptops, but also in terms of the media they sell.
With Flash, folks would have less incentive to buy TV shows and movies, since they can watch them on Hulu or Netflix.
Flash apps and webgames might compete with some regular apps. Though I still think native games and apps have a big advantage.
But I still think some folks who don't know what Flash is and are perfect consumers for simple web access device will get a surprise when they try to watch streaming video or play Farmville, etc.... Pretty basic things that a lot of people expect to be able to do with something that claims to be the best way to access the Web. And they won't know why they can't do this and call tech support....
For the record, the issue I'm talking about isn't stuttering. It's that when I'm in full-screen on Safari and I move the cursor, the controls (volume, status bar, etc.) all appear letting me skip back a few seconds or whatever without pausing the video. When I'm on Firefox, if I move the mouse nothing happens. In order to make the controls appear on screen, I need to click, which automatically pauses the video and THEN the controls appear. And if I don't hit the right one fast enough, they disappear again, making me click again to bring them back up.
Not such a big deal because I just use Safari instead, but it's still dumb. Netflix instant viewing is better on Safari too, but I forgot exactly what the issue was.
Well, there really are only two more applications that the ipad is lacking that would make this product perfect for me. And that is a webcam/camera and a CD/DVD slot.
The webcam would be great for taking a decent size picture and for on location teleconferencing with my classmates, professors,other doctors, and colleges. I would be able to get immediate opinions and answers on any situation that may arise.
The CD/DVD, for me, is a necessity! A Lot of information seems to be kept on CD/DVD and Flash. ie: anatomical maps and terms, medical records, text book supporting programs... Oh, Does the ipad have a flash drive? Another necessity for me.
Also a concern for me... DISK SPACE. Being a PC user, is 64 GB enough? Heck, I have TWO external HD's @ 1 Terra just because my 200GB HD laptop was not enough.
Honestly though, the ipad would be PERFECT for me if these small issues are resolved. I would rush out and buy one immediately.
While the lack of a camera for video-conference may be a dealbreaker, you can plug the iPad into a regular computer and transfer whatever information you need from a CD/DVD. There is an adapter that lets you plug in USB and one that lets you plug in SD.
You might just see that camera as a USB add-on...
Keep in mind, this device is not a replacement for a computer. It's a supplement to computers. You wouldn't WANT to put 2TB of data on this.
So, I do think some folks are underestimating them, and I think Apple will sell lots of them, especially the lower price WiFi only ones. At $499, I can see lots of folks picking one up as a second or third way of accessing the internet at home.
Isn't that what a netbook is for? They cost less and have all the usual things that we've come to expect (250 gig, webcam, flash, multitasking, sd card slot, etc, minus cd drive), and can cost far less than the ipad (I got my netbook, which I love and it's pretty much been my only computer now, for $300-ish). For myself, I can't really see any possible reason to get an ipad. I can see how techy people might find it fun, but for the average person who doesn't 'need' the latest technology, a netbook is probably better if they want something small and transportable.
Also, I have a question. Isn't it going to be mainly people who have iphones who will be most likely to buy the ipad? And if you already have the iphone and a normal computer, why do you need this? I guess I just don't 'get' it, or it's purpose, or what niche it fills that an iphone, normal computer/laptop, or netbook doesn't already fill for that price range.
Actually the Toshiba Netbook almost can. It gets 8.5 hours on a charge. And the Asus ultralight UL-30A gets 10 hours. Though, it 's twice as heavy as a 1.5 lbs iPad.
I, too, love my netbook. I think the iPad is aimed at consuming information and media, whereas a netbook is good for both consuming and creating. Yes, the iPad is a limited device, but the trade off is in terms of simplicity and ease of use. I think some people will be drawn to that.
PCs and macs really can be difficult to use and maintain. Every few months I get a call from my mom asking very basic questions about how to do something on her computer, and it's a challenge to explain to her how accomplish the task. So there is something to be said for a simple device that is quick booting and is very simple for browsing the web, reading books, listening to music.
I don't think anyone really needs this device. But many may want one. People may buy one for the family instead of a second computer. It's trying to fit a certain niche.
Apple has resisted entering the netbook market, and this is their different spin on it. They made different trade offs than netbook manufacturers.
Fiddletree, I think you're right when you predict that many buyers will be iPhone users. I have a iPod touch, and sometimes I find it easier to access information (Facebook, Twitter, simple search) via my iPod touch rather than my laptop. It's just simpler. Having some of the same experience but with a much bigger screen when browsing would be attractive. Having to zoom in and out of Mobile Safari can be annoying. So, I could imagine using one while watching TV in the living room, or using it for some quick reading or browsing before going to sleep in my bedroom. Yes, I can and do use my netbook for this. But for those who don't already have a netbook, this is a solid solution.
Of course...Apple is getting a bit ahead of itself. They aren't even above single digits in market share, they just don't have the clout to force an epic change industry wide like throwing out Flash in favor of (currently much inferior, far less mature) HTML5.
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Lounge:
The Kitchen Sink
- 1/27/10 12:28 pm by Wexie
- 3593 views
It should be today. I'm really curious. Here is a leaked video of it. First Apple Tablet Review Get Live Updates HerePage(s): < Previous 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 ... Next > (236 items total)
Zenin
I still say this thing's best use is as an industrial data tablet, effectively a replacement for actual clip boards:
For every consumer "non-serious" computing need, this thing is a gigantic step backwards at twice the price.
Zenin
It might be almost ok for light sketching, a replacement for napkins. But on that front it would do a hell of a lot better if they teamed up with Wacom and their Cintiq technology. Then it actually would be an impressive, revolutionary device. But Apple doesn't do revolutionary, they only do pretty.
Bird Parker
I totally agree. I am a music pastor for churches. This would be a great thing to put on stage and access the thousands of songs I would want to pull from as well.
Many niches could be found and I don't think Apple is limiting itself. I think people haven't realized what doors this thing is opening up.
Zenin
Sidenote, your response just gave me a great idea: An iPhone/iTouch instrument mount for the standard lyre music adapter. Same idea as yours, just attached to the instruments for marching! :-D
BigCat
I was under the impression that you still need a computer to dock this with iTunes, and sync music/movies/apps/documents/etc. So, you're saying that people without serious computer needs would buy a computer AND an iPad (for when they aren't sitting next to the computer)?
*Unless the iPhone OS gained the ability to do all this stuff without syncing to iTunes and no one told me.
Zenin
You don't need to sync to anything to load content onto an iPhone and I expect the iPad; You can download directly from Apple to the device via the iTunes App.
Of course it would be more then a little bit risky to not sync it with a computer based iTunes, if only for backup reasons. I don't think anyone is suggesting that the iPad can realistically live without a real computer around somewhere, at least not for very long. For instance you can't do OS upgrades without a real computer iTunes.
Wexie
Hitler responds to the iPad
Chivalrous
People called the iPod a disappointment too.
Martinis do not contain vodka. —Rachel Maddow
catlike
True. Folks didn't appreciate how truly different the iPod was and how it would turn out to be a game changer.
I think this is a bit different, since this product is more evolutionary than revolutionary. It is basically a giant iPod Touch/iPhone. This is both an advantage and disadvantage. Disadvantage in that some technophiles are disappointed it isn't more of a breakthrough device with totally new capabilities. But also an advantage, since lots of folks already use iphones and like their apps, which can work on this new device.
So, I do think some folks are underestimating them, and I think Apple will sell lots of them, especially the lower price WiFi only ones. At $499, I can see lots of folks picking one up as a second or third way of accessing the internet at home. Though who knows how the recession may factor into this. And I can imagine them being used in a school/business setting (college textbook reader, data slate for doctors, etc).
The one deal breaker for me is lack of support for Adobe Flash. As I mentioned before, the lack of multitasking was also a disappointment, but I could live without that and can see how running just one app at a time has benefits in terms of ease of use for the tech novices (no need to manage different windows, or remember to shut down processes).
Apple hates Flash and is trying to kill it. It hates it because it doesn't control the code and also because Flash is a resource hog and doesn't run as well as it could on Mac (though part of this is Apple's fault for not working with Adobe). It wants to move the Web ecosystem to HTML 5 and other open standards (which it doesn't control but can adapt). In the short term, however, this screws the consumer. Lots of people will be disappointed the first time they try to access Netflix, Hulu, etc., on their IPad and get a big fat FAIL. Eventually, these sites may start either create apps (like Youtube) for accessing the videos or stream video using an HTML 5 player (again, Youtube is experimenting with this). But Flash is still ubiquitous on the web, and even if other tech is going to win out, it's going to be a long time until Flash is not essential for having the total Web experience.
Zenin
Chivalrous
That's interesting. When I first heard it wouldn't have flash, I assumed it was because of whatever reason the Pre doesn't either (which I have no idea). But in the case of the Pre I keep hearing someday they may add a patch to allow it. Guess that won't happen with the iPad if what you're saying is true.
Side question: Regarding Flash, I noticed a while ago that Hulu runs better if I'm using Safari than if I'm using Firefox (specifically when I'm watching full screen). If the issue was Apple not liking it, wouldn't it make more sense for that to be the other way around?
Martinis do not contain vodka. —Rachel Maddow
Zenin
It's not Safari being good with Flash, it's Firefox being bad. Specifically the new tab sessions saving feature which takes a snapshot of all your tabs every 10 seconds. With a lot of tabs open and/or slower hard disk write speeds, it causes a very noticeable pause or stutter.
http://www.downloadsquad.com/2009/08/22/how-to-fix-flash-video-performance-in-firefox/
That helped me a lot, but not completely. I think I just run too many developer debugging plugins and such that bloat down FireFox. I run Hulu in Chrome now.
Zenin
Re Flash on i(Things). Similar to disallowing multi-tasking, there is much more to it then the official explainations (battery life, etc). That's not an excuse when the device is plugged in and it would be easy to make it aware of the current power source (much like all modern laptops currently do).
The thing is, if you allow multi-tasking...if you allow flash...if you allow bluetooth keyboards... It quickly becomes easy to see how an iPhone/iTouch (much less an iPad) could replace at least one of a household's real computers. It would also be a huge threat to Apple TV.
The computing power of these phone size devices really is enough now to start fully replacing a number of the larger and much more expensive computers in our life. But that's not good business...especially for a company that makes most of its money with those larger, expensive computers. So they have to artificially restrict what it can do or else they shoot themselves in the foot.
catlike
Yeah. I agree that part of the banning Flash thing is protecting their business lines. Not just in terms of overlap with laptops, but also in terms of the media they sell.
With Flash, folks would have less incentive to buy TV shows and movies, since they can watch them on Hulu or Netflix.
Flash apps and webgames might compete with some regular apps. Though I still think native games and apps have a big advantage.
But I still think some folks who don't know what Flash is and are perfect consumers for simple web access device will get a surprise when they try to watch streaming video or play Farmville, etc.... Pretty basic things that a lot of people expect to be able to do with something that claims to be the best way to access the Web. And they won't know why they can't do this and call tech support....
Phlurg
Re: flash:
http://bits.blogs.nytimes.com/2010/01/31/why-the-ipad-web-demo-was-full-of-holes/?hpw
Chivalrous
For the record, the issue I'm talking about isn't stuttering. It's that when I'm in full-screen on Safari and I move the cursor, the controls (volume, status bar, etc.) all appear letting me skip back a few seconds or whatever without pausing the video. When I'm on Firefox, if I move the mouse nothing happens. In order to make the controls appear on screen, I need to click, which automatically pauses the video and THEN the controls appear. And if I don't hit the right one fast enough, they disappear again, making me click again to bring them back up.
Not such a big deal because I just use Safari instead, but it's still dumb. Netflix instant viewing is better on Safari too, but I forgot exactly what the issue was.
Martinis do not contain vodka. —Rachel Maddow
Martini Slayer
Well, there really are only two more applications that the ipad is lacking that would make this product perfect for me. And that is a webcam/camera and a CD/DVD slot.
The webcam would be great for taking a decent size picture and for on location teleconferencing with my classmates, professors,other doctors, and colleges. I would be able to get immediate opinions and answers on any situation that may arise.
The CD/DVD, for me, is a necessity! A Lot of information seems to be kept on CD/DVD and Flash. ie: anatomical maps and terms, medical records, text book supporting programs... Oh, Does the ipad have a flash drive? Another necessity for me.
Also a concern for me... DISK SPACE. Being a PC user, is 64 GB enough? Heck, I have TWO external HD's @ 1 Terra just because my 200GB HD laptop was not enough.
Honestly though, the ipad would be PERFECT for me if these small issues are resolved. I would rush out and buy one immediately.
Keither
64GB is plenty, Winter.
While the lack of a camera for video-conference may be a dealbreaker, you can plug the iPad into a regular computer and transfer whatever information you need from a CD/DVD. There is an adapter that lets you plug in USB and one that lets you plug in SD.
You might just see that camera as a USB add-on...
Keep in mind, this device is not a replacement for a computer. It's a supplement to computers. You wouldn't WANT to put 2TB of data on this.
fiddletree
Isn't that what a netbook is for? They cost less and have all the usual things that we've come to expect (250 gig, webcam, flash, multitasking, sd card slot, etc, minus cd drive), and can cost far less than the ipad (I got my netbook, which I love and it's pretty much been my only computer now, for $300-ish). For myself, I can't really see any possible reason to get an ipad. I can see how techy people might find it fun, but for the average person who doesn't 'need' the latest technology, a netbook is probably better if they want something small and transportable.
Also, I have a question. Isn't it going to be mainly people who have iphones who will be most likely to buy the ipad? And if you already have the iphone and a normal computer, why do you need this? I guess I just don't 'get' it, or it's purpose, or what niche it fills that an iphone, normal computer/laptop, or netbook doesn't already fill for that price range.
Some Guy
it will be years before html5 catches up to the extent of flash adoption. and even then, flash will still be a major part of browsing.
there can only be bad excuses for why the "best web browsing device" doesn't support flash right now. or at least soon.
Keither
Can your netbook run for 10 hours without a charge? :)
You're still a pound heavier and don't have the touch interface, even with a netbook.
fiddletree
fair enough. still not for me, but I can see the weight and battery life things as big selling points, even though I'm not a fan of touch screens.
Keither
If you're not a fan of touch screens, then I don't think it would matter what they added to the iPad -- it still wouldn't be for you. :)
catlike
Actually the Toshiba Netbook almost can. It gets 8.5 hours on a charge. And the Asus ultralight UL-30A gets 10 hours. Though, it 's twice as heavy as a 1.5 lbs iPad.
I, too, love my netbook. I think the iPad is aimed at consuming information and media, whereas a netbook is good for both consuming and creating. Yes, the iPad is a limited device, but the trade off is in terms of simplicity and ease of use. I think some people will be drawn to that.
PCs and macs really can be difficult to use and maintain. Every few months I get a call from my mom asking very basic questions about how to do something on her computer, and it's a challenge to explain to her how accomplish the task. So there is something to be said for a simple device that is quick booting and is very simple for browsing the web, reading books, listening to music.
I don't think anyone really needs this device. But many may want one. People may buy one for the family instead of a second computer. It's trying to fit a certain niche.
Apple has resisted entering the netbook market, and this is their different spin on it. They made different trade offs than netbook manufacturers.
Fiddletree, I think you're right when you predict that many buyers will be iPhone users. I have a iPod touch, and sometimes I find it easier to access information (Facebook, Twitter, simple search) via my iPod touch rather than my laptop. It's just simpler. Having some of the same experience but with a much bigger screen when browsing would be attractive. Having to zoom in and out of Mobile Safari can be annoying. So, I could imagine using one while watching TV in the living room, or using it for some quick reading or browsing before going to sleep in my bedroom. Yes, I can and do use my netbook for this. But for those who don't already have a netbook, this is a solid solution.
catlike
I agree. It really is another example of Steve Job's paternalism and attempt to impose his will/vision on the industry.
Zenin
Many netbooks get 4 to 6 hours real time.
It's not like touch screen netbooks don't exist:
http://www.engadget.com/2009/07/15/asus-eee-pc-t91-review/
Zenin
The article makes some good observations.
Of course...Apple is getting a bit ahead of itself. They aren't even above single digits in market share, they just don't have the clout to force an epic change industry wide like throwing out Flash in favor of (currently much inferior, far less mature) HTML5.
Keither
Please GOD, let the iPad be the final nail in Flash's coffin.
Shanabanana
What's awesome is that I heard if you don't like the iPad's design and features you're allowed to not buy it! Yay capitalism!
Swifty
How much is that option?
4^(1/2) = Rainbows
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