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  Everyone is gay

According to cnn.com: " Massachusetts' highest court reiterated today that only full marriage rights for gay couples, not civil unions, would be constitutional. The ruling sets the stage for Massachusetts to become the first state in the nation to allow same-sex marriages. ".…

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  • Joined 7/20/03
  • 4033
  • Post #91
  • Originally posted Saturday, February 7, 2004 (Over 10 years ago)
Quoted from "dennisrodman"
Quoted from "Dan2513"
marriage Mar"riage, n. [OE. mariage, F. mariage. See Marry, v. t.] 1. The act of marrying, or the state of being married; legal union of a man and a woman for life, as husband and wife; wedlock; matrimony. Source: Webster's Revised Unabridged Dictionary, 1996, 1998 MICRA, Inc.
well, if you're going by webster....this is the definition I got online.... Main Entry: mar riage Pronunciation: 'mer-ij, 'ma-rij Function: noun Etymology: Middle English mariage, from Anglo-French, from marier to marry 1 a (1) : the state of being united to a person of the opposite sex as husband or wife in a consensual and contractual relationship recognized by law (2) : the state of being united to a person of the same sex in a relationship like that of a traditional marriage &lt;same-sex marriage&gt; b : the mutual relation of married persons : WEDLOCK c : the institution whereby individuals are joined in a marriage Source: http://www.webster.com/cgi-bin/dictionary?book=Dictionary&amp;va=marriage

I wonder what militant group threatened to boycott them unless they put that in? Obviously a recent addition and one that contradicts the first. In marriage, there is a husband and there is a wife.

  • Joined 9/23/99
  • 22695
  • Post #92
  • Originally posted Saturday, February 7, 2004 (Over 10 years ago)

Contradicts?

You honestly, truly believe those two definitions contradict each other!?!

-Eff

  • Joined 7/20/03
  • 4033
  • Post #93
  • Originally posted Saturday, February 7, 2004 (Over 10 years ago)

SwingKid570, Denial isn't a river in Egypt.

  • Joined 12/31/69
  • 2788
  • Post #94
  • Originally posted Saturday, February 7, 2004 (Over 10 years ago)
Quoted from "Jake"
Quoted from "swingchick20"
man to woman, woman to woman, or man to man. it's love. that's what is important. ignore the fact that it is "unnatural" :roll: what is more important is that now there can't be laws made to make the option of marriage illegal.
Incidentally, there are plenty of instances of same-sex relations found in nature. Maybe you meant, "less common?"

If you're talking about the animal world, there are even more cases of infanticide. And of not caring for their elderly.

It's always a bit risky to anthropomorhphisize our fellow creatures...

  • Joined 2/25/00
  • 13233
  • Post #95
  • Originally posted Saturday, February 7, 2004 (Over 10 years ago)
Quoted from "Dan2513"
I wonder what militant group threatened to boycott them unless they put that in? Obviously a recent addition and one that contradicts the first. In marriage, there is a husband and there is a wife.

Right. See, because when someone offers proof to you, and you disagree with the point, the most rhetorically sound technique is to dismiss the proof as invalid, EVEN WHEN YOU USE THE SAME SOURCE YOURSELF.

sigh

For serious, why do we bother with you?

We are the keepers of Funny, the Judges, the Whisperers. We are Superior Naysayers And Rebukers of Knavery. We are SNARK. - Boosh!

  • Joined 7/20/03
  • 4033
  • Post #96
  • Originally posted Saturday, February 7, 2004 (Over 10 years ago)

A husband is a man and a wife is a woman. I thought this was common knowledge. What are they teaching kids in school these days???

  • Joined 9/23/99
  • 22695
  • Post #97
  • Originally posted Saturday, February 7, 2004 (Over 10 years ago)

Not to discriminate against people who are different from you, for starters.

-Eff

  • Joined 2/25/00
  • 13233
  • Post #98
  • Originally posted Saturday, February 7, 2004 (Over 10 years ago)

Let's see, Dan...there was a time when a voter was defined as a white man who owned property. I suppose we shouldn't have changed that, right?

Because we cannot change definitions to change with changing times and enlightenment. We have to stick to what was appropriate and current bajillions of years ago.

How's the weather back in the Dark Ages? Don't forget to get your plague vaccination!

We are the keepers of Funny, the Judges, the Whisperers. We are Superior Naysayers And Rebukers of Knavery. We are SNARK. - Boosh!

  • Joined 2/7/01
  • 13635
  • Post #99
  • Originally posted Saturday, February 7, 2004 (Over 10 years ago)

Dan-

Popular vote-

Gore= 51,003,357 Bush= 50,459,621

Leaving aside the contested and questionable 25 electoral votes from Florida,

Gore= 266 Electoral votes Bush= 246 electroal votes

(Source USElectionatlas)

I firmly believe that future historians more than a century from now may just view Bush's presidency similar to that of the reign of the antipopes in the Middle Ages.

For those who don't know what an antipope is, I quote Miriam Websters Online- "one elected or claiming to be pope in opposition to the pope canonically chosen "

The velocity of Spanish is that many tables do not have sadness...

  • Joined 2/25/00
  • 13233
  • Post #100
  • Originally posted Saturday, February 7, 2004 (Over 10 years ago)
Quoted from "SwingKid570"
For those who don't know what an antipope is, I quote Miriam Websters Online- "one elected or claiming to be pope in opposition to the pope canonically chosen "

I wonder what militant group threatened to boycott them unless they put that in? Obviously a recent addition.

We are the keepers of Funny, the Judges, the Whisperers. We are Superior Naysayers And Rebukers of Knavery. We are SNARK. - Boosh!

  • Joined 2/7/01
  • 13635
  • Post #101
  • Originally posted Saturday, February 7, 2004 (Over 10 years ago)
Quoted from "Mugsy Malone"
Quoted from "SwingKid570"
For those who don't know what an antipope is, I quote Miriam Websters Online- "one elected or claiming to be pope in opposition to the pope canonically chosen "
I wonder what militant group threatened to boycott them unless they put that in? Obviously a recent addition.

Historians. You know what radicals they can be...

The velocity of Spanish is that many tables do not have sadness...

  • Joined 7/20/03
  • 4033
  • Post #102
  • Originally posted Saturday, February 7, 2004 (Over 10 years ago)
Quoted from "SwingKid570"
Dan- Popular vote- Gore= 51,003,357 Bush= 50,459,621 I firmly believe that future historians more than a century from now may just view Bush's presidency similar to that of the reign of the antipopes in the Middle Ages.

Translation: WOOHOO! WOOHOO! WOOHOO!

http://www.wiseacre-gardens.com/buttons/pics/sounds/daflaugh.wav

  • Joined 6/8/00
  • 4899
  • Post #103
  • Originally posted Saturday, February 7, 2004 (Over 10 years ago)
Quoted from "Dan2513"
A husband is a man and a wife is a woman. I thought this was common knowledge. What are they teaching kids in school these days???

first off...I can say that a lot of people posting on this thread has been out of school for a long while.

second....did you even read my definition? the 2nd definition stated the definition of same-sex marriage.

same thing like the abortion thing (pro-life/pro-choice debate)....it's not my body, so I'm not gonna decide for other people what they should or shouldn't do. if they choose to marry someone of the same gender....so what. it's good that they finally found a soulmate. isn't that what love is about? finding your one and only someone? if you're heterosexual, your one and only someone will be of the opposite gender. if you're homosexual, then your one and only someone will be of the same gender. either way....I'm happy for you for finding your soulmate.

  • Joined 2/25/00
  • 13233
  • Post #104
  • Originally posted Saturday, February 7, 2004 (Over 10 years ago)
Quoted from "dennisrodman"
second....did you even read my definition? the 2nd definition stated the definition of same-sex marriage.

Right. But Dan3222 disagreed with that definition, therefore it was "wrong".

We are the keepers of Funny, the Judges, the Whisperers. We are Superior Naysayers And Rebukers of Knavery. We are SNARK. - Boosh!

  • Joined 7/20/03
  • 4033
  • Post #105
  • Originally posted Saturday, February 7, 2004 (Over 10 years ago)
Quoted from "dennisrodman"
second....did you even read my definition? the 2nd definition stated the definition of same-sex marriage.

Yeah, it's kind of like a definition of beer where the main definition rightly describes it as an alcoholic beverage, then the 2nd definition mentions non-alcoholic beer. Non-alcoholic beer isn't REALLY beer, just like gay marriage isn't REALLY marriage. They are both imitations with one of the most important elements removed.

  • Joined 7/20/03
  • 4033
  • Post #106
  • Originally posted Saturday, February 7, 2004 (Over 10 years ago)
Quoted from "REDHOTnBLUE"
Quoted from "Dan2513"
Next thing you know, people will want to marry their pets and who knows what else.
I am aggravated to no end by the "two consensual loving adults wanting to commit their loves to each other will soon result in... widespread bestiality!" argument.

Truth is stranger than fiction. http://www.newindpress.com/NewsItems.asp?ID=IEW20040204131617&Page=W&Title=World&Topic=0&

Now I'd like to hear the proponents of so-called "gay marriage" argue why what this article describes is not also marriage.

  • Joined 2/7/01
  • 13635
  • Post #107
  • Originally posted Saturday, February 7, 2004 (Over 10 years ago)

Well Dan, if you want to go old school Warner Brothers on me-

=

Amd by the way. I take pride in you equating me with old school Daffy. He was a character who delighted in bucking conventions and annoying the hell out of idiots who had sticks up their asses. (Like the short where he drew mustches on billboards.)

The velocity of Spanish is that many tables do not have sadness...

  • Joined 8/25/02
  • 4633
  • Post #108
  • Originally posted Saturday, February 7, 2004 (Over 10 years ago)

Okay, before this degenerates completely (HAH! "degenerates!" Hah! okay I'm done) Alot of issues on this thread are stemming from word choice. Dan objects to calling a gay union a "marriage" so don't call it that. Call it a bagel. Call it "George". Call it whatever you want as long as it bears the same legal status as a heterosexual "marriage" under the laws of the United States.

"Marriage" was originally defined as a religious institution and when the government decided to treat married couples differently than single people, they adopted the term "Marriage" because they didn't have (nor did they think they needed) another word for what the couple "was".

So why not allow a gay couple to have a bagel that grants them the same rights as a married couple? Is that also wrong? It's not a "marriage", it's a bagel.

-- M

  • Joined 7/25/99
  • 8826
  • Post #109
  • Originally posted Saturday, February 7, 2004 (Over 10 years ago)

Why call it something different if it isn't different. Just to appease the Archie Bunkers of the world like Dan? Fact of the matter is now it's only a matter of time till other states start adopting similar laws and everyone has got to get used to it. You don't have to agree w/it.....but you have to get used to it. c50s.....coming to a chapel near you!

  • Joined 8/25/02
  • 4633
  • Post #110
  • Originally posted Saturday, February 7, 2004 (Over 10 years ago)

Actually I was asking to see if there was still a problem with it if we called it something else but it was exactly the same in execution (which is necessary)

-- M

  • Joined 4/14/01
  • 2277
  • Post #111
  • Originally posted Saturday, February 7, 2004 (Over 10 years ago)

The problem seems to be that changing the word gives certain groups a chance to say "see it IS different." There's also a great deal of concern given our Nation's illustrious track record with "separate but equal."

If we changed things so that the government no longer recognized "married" as a category with benefits and instead changed it to "united couple" (or something of that nature assuming two people) and allowed the "married" was a status that was solely religious in nature, it might be possible to have a "civil union" that was equivelent.

As for what words "mean," that changes all the time. 100 years ago, if I had said "I'm having a gay affair," it would mean something COMPLETELY different from modern usage.

  • Joined 1/20/99
  • 14694
  • Post #112
  • Originally posted Saturday, February 7, 2004 (Over 10 years ago)

France has sort of a two-tier system, in which "civil unions," whether between a couple of the same sex or a couple of different sex, get SOME of the same rights as a married couple. So straight couples who don't want to get married still get some of the benefits of marriage (tax breaks, insurance, etc.) while gay couples get their relationship recognized by the state. And marriage retains still a more privileged status.

Not perfect, but better.

  • Joined 1/16/01
  • 12597
  • Post #113
  • Originally posted Saturday, February 7, 2004 (Over 10 years ago)

Well let's say for the sake of argument the government does a 180 and says "to hell with it - go ahead." Same-sex marriages are now legal throughout the country.

What happens? What are the harms?

In this country, in order to curtail someone's action, you have to demonstrate a tangible harm from the exercise of said action. In other words, what is the bad thing that is going to happen that is bad enough to trump the right of a homosexual to marry someone of the same sex? And furthermore, how is that bad thing uniquely the fault of allowing homosexual marriages, and not for example, allowing divorces? Only when I hear the potential impacts will I believe that there's more to this than simple anti-gay discrimination.

I'd like to hear some of the responses from those who believe same-sex marriages should be banned.

  • Joined 7/25/99
  • 8826
  • Post #114
  • Originally posted Saturday, February 7, 2004 (Over 10 years ago)

If 1 in 10 people are presumably gay then 1 in 10 Yehoodites are fascists. I think those 1 in 10's have already posted.

  • Joined 7/25/99
  • 8826
  • Post #115
  • Originally posted Saturday, February 7, 2004 (Over 10 years ago)

Interestingly 1 was a man and 1 was a woman. I think they've found a certain new love they can agree on.

  • Joined 10/5/99
  • 1770
  • Post #116
  • Originally posted Saturday, February 7, 2004 (Over 10 years ago)

Dan, I applaud you for continuing to post on this thread despite the fact that your opinion is obviously in the minority around here. I wonder if there are others who also feel the same way you do, but are too much of a wimp about expressing their beliefs here.

I, too, completely disagree with you (to say it nicely). Because all my friends - and in fact the large majority of people I know - also completely disagree with you, I am very intrigued at what you have to say.

My understanding is that on this thread, you are trying to be very clear that your argument is about the actual word "marriage". I know this is slightly off topic, but please permit me to ask a couple questions about you and your beliefs. Likewise, feel free to ask me.

-What religion are you? -Do you believe that Jesus Christ is your Lord and Savior? -Do you believe homosexuality is a sin and that homosexuals will go to Hell? -Do you believe the Bible is the word of God? Do you try to live life in accordance with the Bible? -Do you believe people who divorce will go to Hell? -Do you believe that if I do not accept Jesus Christ as my Lord and Savior and ask him to forgive my sins then I will go to hell?

Thanks for being a part of this discussion.

David

  • Joined 1/30/00
  • 6375
  • Post #117
  • Originally posted Saturday, February 7, 2004 (Over 10 years ago)

Do you find my devil avatar strangely attractive?

  • Joined 2/25/00
  • 13233
  • Post #118
  • Originally posted Saturday, February 7, 2004 (Over 10 years ago)
Quoted from "Miss Behave"
Do you find my devil avatar strangely attractive?

I can't speak for Dan, but there's almost nothing about Miss Behave that I don't find strangely attractive.

Good thing I have never seen her boobs, or else I'd have to marry her!

We are the keepers of Funny, the Judges, the Whisperers. We are Superior Naysayers And Rebukers of Knavery. We are SNARK. - Boosh!

  • Joined 7/20/99
  • 6220
  • Post #119
  • Originally posted Saturday, February 7, 2004 (Over 10 years ago)

I find it funny that I got lumped in with the hypersensitive flaming liberals when my original argument was to change the governmental rights to some openly defined license and make "marriage" be purely a religious and cultural term.

If all Dan wants is for the government to not let gay people get legally "married" then - I hate to say it - we agree.

And yet somehow I'm a hypersensitive flaming liberal.

Which I am by the way.

I like being sensitive to descrimination and inequality and getting in the way of people's civil liberties and basic fundamental rights. I'm proud of being that person.

And I'm also proud of not being someone who would ever relate homosexual relationships to beastiality.

(FYI Dan, that's disrespectful and insulting. It occurred to me you maybe didn't realize that it was since you asked me how you were being disrespectful and insulting. You didn't say it was the same thing so somehow you think it's ok to do. But it's not. Comparing them, relating them, putting them in the same sentence - except to say they are not related - is not ok. There ya go. Now you know.

Also, dismissing other people's arguments in general - which you have done in almost every post you've made - is disrespectful and insulting. So there's another thing.)

Basically, in the end, I want YOU and the government out of my bedroom and out of my church and out of my lovelife and out of my house. That's why I live in America - because supposedly that's what this country was founded upon - basic personal freedoms.

So if I decided to "marry" my girlfriend in my place of worship it's completely ok if you and your church doesn't consider it an actual "marriage". I don't go to your church so no biggie. And you can be happy because you can go on thinking I'm not "married".

But when I die she can inherit my stuff and get the insurance. And she can be on my healthcare plan. And when I'm in the hostipal and they have to decide to cut of life support, she can help with that decision. And if we have a child together, we can both be recognized as legal parents of that child.

NONE OF WHICH HAS ANY AFFECT ON HOW YOU LIVE YOUR LIFE OR WHAT YOU WANT TO BELIEVE ABOUT US!!!

So, to reiterate what I want since it seems a lot of people didn't get this the first time around:

The term "Marriage" would no longer hold ANY governmental meaning.

Some new term would be created - whatever people want, civil union, partnership, whatever.

That new thing would be a license you get from the government which gives you all the rights and breaks "marriage" used to get.

The term "Marriage" would now only apply within religious or cultural ceremonies used by whoever wants it in whatever way.

That's what I would like to see happen.

And correct me if I'm wrong Dan but that shouldn't be in disagreement with your belief system or force anyone to be in support of or recognize anything they don't agree with in any way. So technically, you should be ok with this.

(And for those of you who might think I'm wasting my time with Dan I will say this: there are plenty of other people reading these boards who might be interested in hearing more about the different perspectives on this issue. So I may not affect Dan in the long run, but I might reach someone else. And this issue is important enough for me to want to try.)

  • Joined 8/25/02
  • 4633
  • Post #120
  • Originally posted Saturday, February 7, 2004 (Over 10 years ago)
Quoted from "mouth"
Some new term would be created - whatever people want, civil union, partnership, whatever.

You didn't like bagel?

-- M

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