So was DC the first big scene? It was number one on the list. What about NYC? It would seem NYC should have the most venues especially in Manhattan with hundreds of possible venues.

In my opinion (and I've been dancing since the resurgence in 1997), DC was the first BIG scene. Tom and Debra paved the way by bringing in lots of renown instructors for workshops, teaching hundreds of people to dance on any given Saturday night (America at Tyson's Corner anyone?), and really promoting swing. The quality of leads and follows were amazing, and the events were incredible! And as a disclaimer for Charlie, I never said the scene is not amazing. It's still going strong, but it's not the 1 scene.

Then when Hollywood style got big, LA had the next big scene. Camp Hollywood was a HUGE push for that scene, along with incredible instructors and dancers.

After Hollywood style died down (again, disclaimer, the scene did not die, but the style did), it seemed that Seattle was next on the list. I have not had the pleasure of going there, but all of my girlfriends have told me that you will NEVER have a bad dance there since the quality of leads and followers are awesome. Plus you have big name instructors like Peter, Mia, and Todd (and there's more, but my mind is blank).

Of course NY has a great scene too, but if you were to ask Steven Mitchell or other legends (I know cause I've asked) what the 1 dance scene is in the world, they'll tell you that Seattle is the 1 hot spot. Great dancing, great people, great instruction, etc. I'm just curious where the next big movement will take place. I truly think it will be New Orleans, and I think dancers will actively move here to be a part of the scene.

Although, Montreal could definitely be another option. I have not had the pleasure of going there yet either.

You tell me. I know they have a great scene, but do you think they'll be the next big movement city? There's a lot of incredible scenes, including San Diego, but I'm looking for numero uno!

Quoted from "Chuck Knuckles"
What about NYC?

Quoted from "hoya01"
Where does San Francisco fit into that story?

Pshah. NYC and SF don't matter in jlindyhopr's head.

Why rank all of these scenes? Lots of scenes offer differ benefits and I don't believe one factor or a set of factors enables someone to determine the best. Nonetheless, I think you could use these factors as a rough estimate to say whether the scene is good. I am not very knowledgeable about the Seattle scene other than going there for Camp Jitterbug and it is obviously a great scene. Several people from Seattle have remarked how central charleston is to their scene's style of dancing. This style appeals to some and less to others. I haven't lived there to be able to compare the average dance with DC. I would imagine top level instructors are usually in a scene on account of a dance weekend, which makes it hard to judge the merits of the everyday dancing life. Nonetheless, the energy and direction of that scene might appeal more or less to different people.

For example if you are a balboa dancer, what would be the best scene? While Seattle probably has lots of great dancers, is it the best? Here in DC, we have Kelly Arensault, Kate Hedin, Bobby White and David Rehm. If you love collegiate shag LA and San Francisco has some of the best shag dancers. But there are other factors that make up a great scene. For example some smaller and mid sized scenes can be more integrated in terms of the beginner, intermediate, and advanced dancers. In bigger scenes you might have Lindy All Stars in the room but they are not always interested in dancing. In smaller and midsize scenes I notice alot more mentoring of up and coming dancers. So there are many reasons for moving to any number of dance scenes. It depends upon what you are looking for. That said I think the overall direction of the lindy hop scene is towards more late twenties and early thirties style music and New Orleans has a good opportunity to grow by tapping into that aesthetic direction of the swing scene. And heck who wouldn't want to see the Losse Marbles on a regular basis?!

I'm saying we're going to be the next big dance scene due to legal drinking in the streets and a movement toward showing titties in public! Oh, and twigs and berries!

I think that's happening in a lot of smaller scenes. There is Lindy Hop and good dancers coming from places that weren't on the Lindy Hop map a decade ago.

It also helps when scene leaders all work for the greater good of the scene. Small scenes like mine are too small to support competing groups and sometimes are too small to support frequent workshops and big social events. There is lots of cooperation within the local scene and with nearby scenes (5-6 hour drive) for the greater good.

Quoted from "jlindyhopr"
In my opinion (and I've been dancing since the resurgence in 1997), DC was the first BIG scene. ... Then when Hollywood style got big, LA had the next big scene. Camp Hollywood was a HUGE push for that scene, along with incredible instructors and dancers. After Hollywood style died down (again, disclaimer, the scene did not die, but the style did), it seemed that Seattle was next on the list.

From an historical perspective California, L.A. in particular, has most often been the 1 scene. You might call it the "default 1 scene" that takes this spot when no other scene has the chops to knock it down a notch or two at a given moment. That is not to say it will be the next "big scene" in the immediate future, but the long term trend has been the California scene, centered in L.A. has most often held that spot.

Factors that keep this scene in the limelight include:

• The Dean Collins thing: Dean built his reputation after bringing Lindy Hop into the local dance scene from the Savoy. If you trace a "who taught whom" chain of current "rock star" instructors, it always goes back to Frankie Manning, Dean Collins, or both. Having one of the two sources of lindy dance and culture identified with this scene always brings it to people's attention, particularly when they read histories of Lindy Hop.

• Hollywood (related to the Dean Collins thing): L.A. has long been and still remains "the movie capitol of the world". Motion pictures have long been the main popularizer of swing music and swing dance to the rest of the nation and the world. Dean Collins built his career primarily by being the "go to" person for the movie industry whenever they needed swing dancers or choreography. Whitey's Lindy Hoppers also became nationally known primarily due to their film appearances. Lindy held onto some major national attention during the 1950's largely due to dance scenes in movies like "Don't Knock the Rock" and "Untamed Youth" featuring teenage Lindy dancers during the early days of R&B, Doo Wop and R&R. The "swing craze" of the 1990's was jump started primarily through the popularity of "Swing Kids", "Swingers". It will be hard for any other scene to develop a resource like this.

• Dance history: Balboa and Bal Swing were created not far from L.A. Even though Lindy Hop was basically an import from Harlem, thanks to Dean Collins and his followers, L.A. became a Lindy scene second only to New York during the 1930's and '40s. These dancers were instrumental in extending lindy hop culture beyond the African American community into the larger "mainstream" American culture. For better or worse, these dancers went on to create WCS. Having a habit and reputation for developing and/or popularizing so many dances has always kept this scene on the radar screen for the rest of the country.

• Massive population: L.A. has always had a critical mass of population large enough to support "niche cultures". When lindy culture died out everywhere else by the early 1960's L.A. became the only Lindy scene to remain truly active through the late 1960's, 1970's and 1980's when it began to grow again. The swing revival actually began there in the 1980's, years before "Swing Kids", "Swingers" and the Gap Commercial made it a nationwide thing.

This L.A. centered California scene periodically falls out of the 1 position, but due to the sheer number of dancers (and dances) there, along with a culture with continuity that extends from the 1920's to the present with no complete hiatus, it is likely to periodically occupy the number one spot as it has throughout all these decades.

Quoted from "jlindyhopr"
... it seemed that Seattle was next on the list. I have not had the pleasure of going there, but all of my girlfriends have told me that you will NEVER have a bad dance there since the quality of leads and followers are awesome. Plus you have big name instructors like Peter, Mia, and Todd (and there's more, but my mind is blank)...

Forgot Falty, Stefan, and Bethany, eh? ;)

Aww, I love hearing great things about our Scene.

I've only been dancing for coming on 2 years now, but Ive been able to dance 5-7 nights a week, consistently since I began. One of those nights has alcohol, the others just have great dancers. I've travelled as much as I can, but not as much as others...I was intending on moving away from Seattle for awhile, and then after travelling to a few cities and doing their weekly dances, They just couldnt compare. Events may be great in certain cities, or I may have been in those cities for "off-weeks" but I know that our regular, normal weekly stuff is phenomenal, and I've yet to experience a scene that matches up to that. I've decided not to move based on my travels, because nothing compares right now.

For 5 weekly dances, 3 have attendance that has a lot of our "rock stars" out, and most of our non-nationally recognized people are dedicated (obsessed) dancers who go out 2-5 nights and are a blast to dance with

One downside I know we have in Seattle is a lack of good live music, we import bands every now and again, and we have some good local flavor, but nothing super fantastic (we're getting there though).

Our number of weekly venues is awesome, the dancers are always great, its a fantastic place to learn to dance, and we have some of the most enjoyable, and upbeat DJ'd music around. Our normal dances stay away from bluesey-crap and groove/soul. Also, from everything I've experienced and been told, Seattle is the Fastest scene around (rivaled by DC and Denver) and what better way to dance Lindy hop then at breakneck speeds? :)

My vote for next "rising star" scene has to be Denver. Im surprised it has yet to be mentioned here.

But thanks for all the love for Seattle :) Come visit us for Camp Jitterbug, SEALX, Killer Diller Ball, Seattle Bal-Swing Fest (going on this weekend), Century Masters weekend, or our Upcoming Savoy Swing Jam (competition day at the end of march) put on by Mark Kihara and Casey Schnieder. :)

It seems that New Orleans is the number one destination swing scene. Everyone wants to go there to visit. It's a beloved romantic city, but it might be hard to actually live there because it is a smaller city.

Seattle, DC, LA, NYC, SF are big cities. That's probably the main reason they exploded.

My bet is on Austin. Right now, I believe they only have one regular dance a week but there are many other events going on all the time. Not a huge city but it is a college town. Insane music scene. It's also one of those cities that people seem to move to in their post-college years. And unlike NYC, another city people move to in their post-college years, Austin seems like it would be be easier to live in for the long haul because it's still relatively cheap to live there. Since a lot of the dancers are older now, it has a good balance of being a fun city where you can get your drink on but still stable place to find a job, buy a house and raise kids.

Austin has a weekly swing dance, a weekly blues dance, a monthly swing/blues dance, a monthly dance with live music, and a weekly practice dance.

We also host a lindy exchange, a blues workshop/social dance weekend, and a social competition event every year.

And our cost of living is less than that of NYC, Seattle, San Francisco, and D.C. :)

Don't know. Have you asked Google?

Quoted from "goofball"
That said, no way seattle is going to slow down anytime soon and relinquish the "best swing scene" title. It's nucking futs up there.

Did you just give Seattle the "best swing scene" title? I would say, hardly.

Dancing to live jazz music IS what keeps jazz dancing alive! True, there are many great dancers living in the mountains of Washington (I had a great time dancing on my two week visit and look forward to CJ this year), but where is your live music?

A few times annually? Once a week, sometimes maybe.....at a restaurant named New Orleans Creole. ;) You can see where I'm going with this.

Chance

Quoted from "almostapoet"
Did you just give Seattle the "best swing scene" title? I would say, hardly. Dancing to live jazz music IS what keeps jazz dancing alive! True, there are many great dancers living in the mountains of Washington (I had a great time dancing on my two week visit and look forward to CJ this year), but where is your live music? A few times annually? Once a week, sometimes maybe.....at a restaurant named New Orleans Creole. ;) You can see where I'm going with this. Chance

Live jazz is a really important part of a strong scene -- I totally agree with that. But's it doesn't make a scene on it's own.

I'll make a disclaimer that I've not been to New Orleans for lindy hop. I do not have a full understanding of the range of musicians/bands that play there. If I had to guess though, I'd say that the town is heavy on dixieland, early N.O. style bands -- mostly small combos. (If i'm mistaken, please do correct me!) While I personally enjoy those types of bands, they don't have the range of musical sounds that most dance scenes desire. This is why DJs are important. There are people that enjoy DJed dances as much and sometimes more than live music dances because of the diversity of music a DJ can provide. Don't get me wrong, live music provides a vibe and energy that can't be replicated by canned music, but it's limited by what the bands are interested in playing.

Seattle has only recently started trying to develop stronger relationships between the dance scene and the regional musicians. I say regional because we often employ Canadian musicians or Portland musicians to play for us as well. The PNW has a decent trad scene with good festivals so there are bands for hire around. The trick is putting together bands that play what people are interested in dancing to, and on that front there are local organizers and promoters, and even new band leaders working to keep things fresh.

Seattle has a great stock of DJs as well, and I think this makes part of my point. There are several active DJs that are constantly pushing themselves and the dancers with new music to inspire intermediate/advanced dancers, as well as playing solid favorites that newer dancers can get hooked into.

This is not meant as a knock to New Orleans DJs. I'm not familiar with them or what they play so I make no comment on that front. My points are in response to the assertion that live music is the top factor in making a great scene.

In short (ha!), while I think Chance's point of view about live music is really important to keep in mind, ultimately I think it's a good mix of live music and strong DJs that keep a scene's dancers satisfied over time. (not to mention all the other things people have sited as key factors -- teachers, population, venues, booze, events, etc)

I'll also add that I'm not making any claims for Seattle as the "bestest scene in the multiverse" or anything, just responding to Chances thoughts.

Now if you only had the good dancers to go with the good booze and good music.

:green: