Hey folks... this seems like a great little community you have here... lots of smart, interesting, fun-loving people... and I hope you'll consider this admittedly obnoxious question... because it's offered sincerely.
So, I started dating this girl about a month and a half ago. I knew from the start that she was into dancing (2 nights a week at least -here in San Francisco) and I suppose that in the beginning I figured we'd just date pretty casually... but, we're gravitating toward something more serious... and we like each other lots.
The thing is... I'm not a dancer... which, probably seems strange to my girl and her friends because for the last 15 years I've collected and bought and sold vintage clothes from the 30's & 40's... and like, I've got all the vintage gear to go with the music and the moves.
I guess I'm just not really that much of a dancing-type-a-guy though. I'm more of a misanthropic, skateboarder, angst-y, furniture-maker, dresses up to look cool but then just sits there and doesn't talk to anyone but his close friends-kinda guys. Not that I'm proud of that... it's just how I've rolled in the past.
But, it's obvious that my girl would love it were I to start dancing with her. And, I'll concede... we would make a really cute team.
My hold up is... there's really no way I would consider dancing without the motivation of her increasing disappointment and longing. I mean, I think dancing is cool, and I love watching youtube clips of it and stuff, but it's just not really something you can do casually and be competent at. (this assumption btw is borne of reading from this message board and listening to some of the podcasts and hearing my girl and her friends talk about it) And, certainly part of my hang-up is that I hate doing stuff I'm not good at when the learning, and foolish-looking, and mistake-making has to take place in a public setting... touching sweaty people even!
Also, honestly... I don't think I'm ready to be assimilated into a new "community". I'm already spread a little thin as it is across a bunch of other pursuits... so, it feels overwhelming to dive into this scene (lifestyle?) knowing that it'll take a huge investment for me to feel confident.
Of course, another thing is that because I'd really only be participating for the sake of this singular, adorable girl... I'm not really stoked to dance with anybody else... like, the social dancing stuff (which, I understand is how you hone your skills).
Sometimes I'm just like, "f*ck it... I'll just go to the beginners class and start trying to figure this out... it'll be fun... I'll learn something new, and maybe this'll be good to make me more sociable"... but then the other half of the time I think, "ugh. this sucks. Maybe it's cool that dancing is just her thing. I'm not jealous that she's out doing her thing twice a week...I'm glad she has that... and it might actually be better for me to stay aloof from that whole deal..."
I dunno. This has got to be super annoying to read... so, I deserve whatever snark you want to toss this way... or, if you're feeling generous, feel free to illuminate my world somehow.
It just sucks when you date a dancer 'cause it feels like you have to align yourself on one side or the other.... you're either a pro-dance, affable participator... or, you're a surly, un-cooperative, fun-hating, non-dancer.
And, for the record... as with other things I've focused my passions on... I know I could be a good dancer... I have good rhythm and co-ordination and stuff. But, y'know... I also want to be authentic, and I don't know if it's authentic to start on this path only so I can dance with my girl every now and then and make her happy.
Originally posted Thursday, March 26, 2009 (3 years ago)
Dating a dancer... that does put you in a somewhat awkward position. My biggest thought is that if you don't dance, will you get jealous? She will be wrapping her arms around other men several nights a week, and if you don't know the dance scene, that can easily be misinterpretted.
I do want to point out that dancing is not nearly as difficult to learn as you seemtothink, especially if you are using podcasts and Yehoodi as a reference. I would encourage you to take a lesson or two and try going out, at least to see what the scene is like with your own eyes, and meet some of your GF's dance buddies.
Originally posted Thursday, March 26, 2009 (3 years ago)
First off welcome! This should be an interesting discussion.
I'll make some overarching generalizations that are mostly true. MOST people who really LOVE a social hobby ultimately wants to be with someone who they can share that hobby with sometimes. That doesn't mean that they want to do every hobby that their partner does all the time, just that every once in a while it's nice to do something you love with the person you love. At some point you may force her to choose between you or dancing and one will lose. Factor in that she's meeting new guys twice a week and those odds just got slightly worse for you.
Quote it's just not really something you can do casually and be competent at.
Competent - sure you can. The learning curve at the beginning though can be steep at times, absolutely, and you'll have to put some time and energy in. Once you have it you can be quite casual, learn how to use a few moves in lots of different ways for three minutes, then make your way over to the bar with the other snappy dressers who will welcome you with open arms.
Dancing with only your date is not the best thing socially - but I think most guys who start dancing because of a girl get over that when they become more confident with their dancing and see her dance with everyone in the room. I'd suggest putting the money into privates - you'll be fast tracked and won't have to worry as much about the social aspects until you're comfortable.
Sounds like to me you'd like to be a lounger - which is a good place to be IMO. Dance a few selective songs a night, hang out near the bar with a small group of similarly dressed and mannered people, really listen to and enjoy the music regardless of the danceableness of each tune. Truthfully, it's a great life. I go back and forth depending on my mood and event.
Do you know how awkward it is to have a political argument with a naked man?
Originally posted Thursday, March 26, 2009 (3 years ago)
My first response when I saw the title of this thread was, "No, learn dancing for all the other girls you might ever date in your life."
I say take a beginner class and find out for yourself if you really like it. If you take the class with your girlfriend, it'll be a great way to spend some time together and show her you care and are interested in her interests. Or you could take it secretly, then surprise her with a spin on the dancefloor.
Originally posted Thursday, March 26, 2009 (3 years ago)
Let's say your significant other (or you) was into baseball or horse-riding or crocheting that they spent a couple of nights a week on. That's cool - everyone's got different interests. There's no reason why dancing shouldn't be any different. I know many people who's partner (even some who are married) doesn't dance and who are pretty keen dancers.
That being said though, it's a fun, enjoyable and social activity, you obviously don't need to impress this woman. And if you do take the plunge it will be awkward and you'll be shy and meeting new people etc. But you can get to the other side. The flip side is that there are many couples who do dance and it's a great activity to do with your partner.
There are ways that you could "test the water" so to speak. Head out to dance gigs with live bands and prop up the bar - meet a couple of the people and spend some time with your girl when she's not cutting a rug. Try out a couple of drop-in beginner lessons - everyone is in the same boat as you so that should help.
And at the end of the day if it's not your thing, it's not your thing and if this woman is the sort that you would want to be with then she'll respect that and the two of you will find other things to do together.
Originally posted Thursday, March 26, 2009 (3 years ago)
I started dancing for a girl. She no longer dances, I still do.
So, you never know. Give it a try. If you absolutely hate it after a few classes and going out, then you know. But until you do it, you can't really say anything.
That said, it's fine for couples to have different interests as long as they support each other in their respective passions, and maintain enough balance in their relationship doing stuff they like to do together.
Originally posted Thursday, March 26, 2009 (3 years ago)
The way I see it is what do you have to lose? Give it a try!!! Life is too darn short not to!
The worse that will happen is you won't like it and will decide not to stick with dancing. . .even in that instance your gal will be thrilled you gave it a go!
Originally posted Thursday, March 26, 2009 (3 years ago)
I have a lot of different, and sometimes conflicting, thoughts on this.
Quoted from "rikomatic" I started dancing for a girl. She no longer dances, I still do.
This happens a lot. You would be shocked to find out just how many guys started dancing for a girl. And how many of the girls stopped dancing while the guy kept going.
So you never know! You may really get into it.
That being said, I have a couple of unmentioned cons for you:
I was once dumped by someone because he felt pressured to dance when he really didn't want to. The reality is, if he had talked to me about it, I would have been completely fine with it.
Dating a guy who's just learning to dance is hard. It's tough to be patient and to avoid criticism, and couples actually tend to do much better (with their attitude toward each other and the dance, not just improvement of skills) when they dance mainly with other people. Also, some girls who've really come to understand and appreciate good dancing can be turned off by a guy who dances poorly.
We've had this discussion on the board many times, but from the opposite perspective ("could you date a non-dancer"). I'm currently of the mindset that I'd rather date a really good dancer or someone who doesn't dance at all. No in between. No non-dancers who would like to learn. Everyone, however, has a different answer to your question, and in order to figure out your particular situation, you will have to find out what your girl's answer is (and then whether she is worth it to you).
Here's my advice based on the limited information I have about your situation...
Take a couple of group or private lessons without her there
Dance with her in your living room. This is sweet and romantic and I think nearly every girl appreciates this, regardless of how good of a dancer you are.
If you can find any venues with a live band and a bar, go with her and just take in the atmosphere (as other people have suggested). You don't have to dance unless you want to.
By the way, I'm another one of those people who hates doing things in public until she's good at them. Somehow, I got over that feeling pretty quickly when I started swing dancing. There's something about it...
Originally posted Thursday, March 26, 2009 (3 years ago)
I don't know that this is part of the problem but fear of dancing ranks second on many lists next to only fear of public speaking. Can you believe that most people are more scared to dance than they are to die? Nevertheless, it would be understandable to be a little fearful of an activity that is so foreign. Partnered dancing used to be a much larger part of the public consciousness and consequently I would assume less feared. I think part of the reason is because dances are where people met their significant other. That said it would not be inauthentic at all for you to learn to dance for a girl. In fact, it would be very genuine. People come to dance for many reasons and stay for many different reasons as well. And you never know...that competitive drive that you appear to have might spur you later to dance for yourself.
Of course, you don't have to share every hobby together. At least for me dance is such a large part of my life that if I were dating a nondancer, then I would want them to participate in any way they could. If you haven't already, you could talk to her and gauge what her expectations and even more so what her wishes are.
What are the dance venues like where she dances? Are they bars where nondancers can have a drink and relax? If they are dance studios it might feel awkward to sit and watch, but then again it would also feel awkward to dance for the first time. Perhaps it might be easier to feel at ease if the two of you went to a venue that had nondancers as well. Let us know how it turns out.
Originally posted Thursday, March 26, 2009 (3 years ago)
Honestly- a good portion of dancers started dancing because they had a crush on a dancer or because they were dating a dancer.
I am kind of in the reverse position as you; my boyfriend isn't really so much into the dance thing. I've taught him, taken him to camps and dances, and he is freakin' crazy natural at it, but he doesn't want to do anything in public that he isn't awesome at, and ends up getting more stressed about dancing that enjoying it.
So, we have both tried to get him into dancing, and so far it hasn't taken, and that is fine. It is perfectly fine to have different interests, and he doesn't have to swing dance for me to love him. However-and there is a bit of the flip side- I do love dancing with him. I don't care that he is a beginner, that he makes mistakes while dancing. It is simply a joy to be able to share this with him, at any level, because it really is a way of communicating that is important in my life, and a really great way to connect. No matter if he sucks or becomes the best in the world.
I think the point we are at now is just that- he knows what he knows, and it isn't something he is going to pursue. But it is something that we can do together in our house, if we want, or at 2 am in a restaurant on the top of the Alps, to no music, after a few shots of grappa (haha... this happened about 5 days ago!).
So basically my advice comes down to this: You don't need to become a dancer. However, it would probably mean a lot to her (and potentially to you, as well) if you tried, just a little. You don't even need to become competent, just barely functional. That way you can dance around in your kitchen with her, or something, but don't need to go out dancing, unless you want to. And, like others have said, you might find that you really like it a lot more than you expected :D
follow my adventures at www.AppalachianToAlpine.blogspot.com!
Originally posted Thursday, March 26, 2009 (3 years ago)
Before I met a girl who was a dancer, I would never have considered taking classes or attending a dance. But, I took a class while she was away on business, just to please her. The girl is long gone now, but dancing was the surprise of my life in how much I loved it from day one. I never expected that. I'm glad that I did it, whether or not it was for her, but she was the motivation. Maybe you'll have a similar experience, but if not what have you lost?
Originally posted Thursday, March 26, 2009 (3 years ago)
"Of course, another thing is that because I'd really only be participating for the sake of this singular, adorable girl... I'm not really stoked to dance with anybody else... like, the social dancing stuff (which, I understand is how you hone your skills). "
For most of my dancer friends, dance is also where we experience a social outlet during the week. I don't care if they guy I date is a dancer or non-dancer--he just needs to be able to mingle and make his own fun if he comes out while I'm dancing. I need to dance and connect in the community I've been a part of for over a decade. If you intend to use dances as a place to monopolize your partner, that likely won't work for most swing dancers.
Originally posted Thursday, March 26, 2009 (3 years ago)
Quoted from "shoji" Hey folks... this seems like a great little community you have here... lots of smart, interesting, fun-loving people...
What board have you been reading?
That being said, sounds like there is actually some good advice and food for thought. In summary, give it a shot and see how it works for you. But don't keep it up if it doesn't really speak to you.
And there is also nothing wrong with learning enough to be able to have fun going out and dancing. You don't have to be like super great at it. There are plenty of people who are socially entwined in the dance community, who don't take it all that seriously as a craft. It's okay to know how to do the basics and have fun for a few minutes when you go out with your GF. Just don't expect her to dance with you all night. As long as there is a bar, you will generally be fine ;-)
Originally posted Thursday, March 26, 2009 (3 years ago)
Consider doing it just to get over your fear of not looking cool; to challenge yourself.
Consider that having some idea how to dance is a valuable life skill that is far better learned with a competent partner, and that your girlfriend represents a ready-made practice partner. Seriously, if you would ever think you ever might want to learn, now would be your best opportunity. The girl might one day be long gone. The skill will remain.
Consider making it less black n white. You don't have to go all in and become a dancer. You could just try it out. Have you ever just asked her to show you some stuff? Or gone just to watch?
Follows who don't want to get wet shouldn't dance with me.
Originally posted Thursday, March 26, 2009 (3 years ago)
You might like it, you might not. You might like it enough to invest more time and effort into getting good and looking really cool doing it.
But you won't know unless you try ...
Also, if you learned to dance, even if you didn't dance the whole night with your girl (because chances are, she's there to social dance, not just dance with you), at least you'd be in the same space as her, hanging with her friends (who might become your friends) etc. If that's important to you, then come on and dance. If it's not, that's cool.
Just because you learn to dance doesn't mean you always have to dance ... so you don't lose anything.
Quote I hope you never fear those mountains in the distance
Never settle for the path of least resistance
Living might mean taking chances
But they're worth taking
Lovin' might be a mistake
But it's worth making
Don't let some hell bent heart
Leave you bitter
When you come close to selling out
Reconsider
Give the heavens above
More than just a passing glance
And when you get the choice to sit it out or dance
I hope you dance ...
(Lee Ann Womack)
"Change your thoughts, and you change your world" - Norman Vincent Peale.
Originally posted Thursday, March 26, 2009 (3 years ago)
As others have said I think we all have a different idea of what we want from the dance. So I certainly don't speak for us all but since you asked for opinions...here is mine...
I would hate it if a guy started dancing only for me. I wouldn't want to be obligated to spend half my night dancing with him. And god forbid he is a bad dancer then I would feel obligated to dance with him anyway since he did it just for me. (it would be another story if he was doing it for himself...then I wouldn't feel such a huge obligation)Then I would start to feel like he was invading my life because I would no longer have time away from him. I would probably start resenting him for wrecking "my thing" and dump him so I wouldn't have to dance with him anymore. I am actually getting hives right now thinking about it.
and yes, I realize that I am a cantankerous, commitment-phobic bitch and I am completely comfortable with that.
You said that it is "obvious" that she'd like it if you danced with her. Has she ever blatantly said that of is it just an assumption? I once had a guy that I dated for a short period decide that he wanted to dance with me. It forced me into a position where I had to introduce him to my friends and I wasn't really ready for that. Then he couldn't understand why I still needed to dance with other guys now that I had him. If I brought every person that I dated for a month or two dancing the New York scene would have a lot more leads (and maybe a few more follows) but I would probably have to move to another country so that I could dance in peace. (aside from being a bitch...i am also kind of a tramp and I am completely comfortable with that as well)
So...if it really is about HER...then make sure it is what SHE wants. Even though I think dancing for her is not such a hot idea, I do think you should dance for you because it is rad.
Originally posted Thursday, March 26, 2009 (3 years ago)
My random thoughts on the subject.
Dance because you want to and in a way you want to.
Taking a few beginner lessons for her sake is cool. At the very least you will gain a slightly better appreciation of all that goes into her dancing.
But if you stick with it, stick with it because you want to. If you aren't having fun, the person you are dancing with probably won't be having fun either.
Some general tips that may be of some use. Not all teachers or dance venues are the same. If possible find a teacher who dances in a way you like and learn from them. Different people show up to different venues, while learning find a venue that has people you are more comfortable with. Realize that neither of these choices may be the same ones that your significant other would make.
And don't worry too much about being swallowed by the scene or being pegged as "pro-dance, affable participator... or, a surly, un-cooperative, fun-hating, non-dancer". Theres room for in between.
I've been a misanthropic, angst-y, doesn't talk to anyone but his close friends kind of dancer for years. The number of people I love dancing with on a given night is much larger than the number of dancers I have had substantive conversations with and much much larger than the number of dancers I would actually be comfortable hanging out with.
Originally posted Thursday, March 26, 2009 (3 years ago)
I wish I had an easy answer for you. Or could lend you my abilities for a while.
It sounds like you have a great grasp of the situation and the dynamics in play. So, I think you'll do well whatever you decide. But over the years I've seen a lot of these mixed relationships have problems - usually from jealousy, time and other personal issues.
I suggest you try to open yourself to dancing with other people as much as possible (otherwise you might be hanging around at events twiddling your thumbs and leads are pretty much always in demand). It is not necessarily a romantic thing and there's lots of benefits.
Of course, I should listen to my own advice, as I still spend much of my time watching!
Originally posted Thursday, March 26, 2009 (3 years ago)
I voted and was pleased to see everyone encouraging this guy to jump in.
I've been a big evangelist over the years and I don't know anyone who has had regrets. A majority of people drop out though, but they certainly remember that they've... (cue music) HAD THE TIME OF THEIR LIVES.
Originally posted Thursday, March 26, 2009 (3 years ago)
mmmm.... these are some great perspectives... lots to think about... thanks everyone... I appreciate your thoughtfulness. I need to digest it all a little more and I'll be back a little later with more detail/thoughts.
Originally posted Thursday, March 26, 2009 (3 years ago)
Quoted from "shoji" I'm more of a misanthropic, skateboarder, angst-y, furniture-maker, dresses up to look cool but then just sits there and doesn't talk to anyone but his close friends-kinda guys.
Originally posted Thursday, March 26, 2009 (3 years ago)
Do you drink? Because if you do, then you could still totally fit in her scene without dancing. You're just the guy in vintage clothes, holding a cocktail, and too cool to dance. :P
I actually know of lots of folks who date dancers, who hang out with dancers, but don't really dance. Dancing is only a little different from any other hobby in that it basically requires socializing with the opposite sex.
If you do learn to dance, make sure you can handle some criticism from your girl. If you don't, make sure you don't get jealous of her activities involving other guys. Either way, these are things that a guy has to get past to even have a decent relationship.
Originally posted Thursday, March 26, 2009 (3 years ago)
Consider learning a dance together that she does not know. Bear in mind that she will still be better than you and learn faster.
Foxtrot can be danced to a lot of swing music. Or you can go out in left field with one of the latin dances such as Salsa. ( I know it's Ballroom, but that might be a good place to start.)
Originally posted Thursday, March 26, 2009 (3 years ago)
I think if you like the music and the era and the dance looks interesting try it...can't hurt.
If you decide you do like it don't go out expecting her to spend all her time with you. That is a lot of pressure. Best to get lessons from people other then her because my experience is this can cause lots of pressure in a relationship.
If you decide you don't want to dance but you want to stay with her you need to not be jealous.
Personally I am married to a non-dancer. We dated for 4 years before getting married. Dancing is definitly a less focused part of my life then it was but it is still there. He trusts me to use good judgement while out dancing and I have never pressured him to learn. Before my husband I dated a dancer and that for me personally was a lot more stress.
Originally posted Thursday, March 26, 2009 (3 years ago)
It is not wrong for you to try it because someone you like does it. Who knows, maybe you'll like it. If you don't like it, at least you'll have learned something about what she does. And if she really does want you to try it, she'll appreciate the effort.
But do make sure you talk to her about it first. So you both understand what expectations really are.
If she wants you to dance with her, it is probably because she wants to dance with you, and not because she needs you to be good at it. And unless you turn out to have her level of interest, she'll always be better than you at it. But that will only work if you're both okay with being at different skill levels. It's a good idea to think about it in advance, whether this will be an issue, and to continue to discuss later in case either of your feelings change. If you want to be more casual about it, and she's happy to dance with you at a low skill level, then great. But if that feels crappy to either of you, and you don't become obsessed, then there should come a time when you give up the idea of dancing together.
It will also be important to her that she doesn't feel obligated to entertain you all the time when you go with her to dances. If you're fine dressing for a dance, listening to the music, talking to people, and not dancing much, then she'll be fine too. But if she feels like she has to spend all her time with you, rather than dancing with her favorite partners, out of concern that you'll be bored, she won't look forward to dancing with you.
Keep in mind, though, that my advice is colored by my experience, and yours may be different.
My husband and I actually started dancing together. He really only did it because he knew I wanted to. He likes the music, but he isn't interested in dancing, and he was relieved when I saw that and told him not to keep it up if he didn't enjoy it. But I do appreciate that he made the effort to try it, and it would probably bug me if he'd never been willing to give it a try.
I love it when he comes to a dance on occasion, but I especially likes it when he brings his camera so that he'll have something to keep him entertained while I dance with other people. I wish he'd dance with me once in a while, but he rarely does because he's self conscious about me being better at it than he is. I'm perfectly fine with dancing with someone at his level (he has a really nice feel, actually), but I can tell it makes him uncomfortable, so I try not to push it. It's just not fun when he's uncomfortable with it. Mostly, I go dancing when I want to, and he goes out for photo shoots when he wants to, and we coordinate so someone's always around to watch the kids. And it works just fine.
Originally posted Thursday, March 26, 2009 (3 years ago)
Quoted from "shoji" mmmm.... these are some great perspectives... lots to think about... thanks everyone... I appreciate your thoughtfulness. I need to digest it all a little more and I'll be back a little later with more detail/thoughts.
I know a couple. The girl dances. The guy doesn't. But the guy is way popular in the dance scene, as he comes out with her when she dances and he just socializes with everyone at the dance. Everyone knows he's not into dancing, but he's a cool guy and is great fun to chat with. You can always consider this approach.
You can also show your support by trying a hand at DJing swing music, if you dig the music and like to collect it. Alternatively, if your girl is all about supporting a particular dance venue, ask about volunteering to collect admission at that venue. You'll socialize with lots of people, support her and the dancing, without actually having to worry about dancing.
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So, do I learn to dance for the girl I'm dating... or what?
Hey folks... this seems like a great little community you have here... lots of smart, interesting, fun-loving people... and I hope you'll consider this admittedly obnoxious question... because it's offered sincerely.
So, I started dating this girl about a month and a half ago. I knew from the start that she was into dancing (2 nights a week at least -here in San Francisco) and I suppose that in the beginning I figured we'd just date pretty casually... but, we're gravitating toward something more serious... and we like each other lots.
The thing is... I'm not a dancer... which, probably seems strange to my girl and her friends because for the last 15 years I've collected and bought and sold vintage clothes from the 30's & 40's... and like, I've got all the vintage gear to go with the music and the moves.
I guess I'm just not really that much of a dancing-type-a-guy though. I'm more of a misanthropic, skateboarder, angst-y, furniture-maker, dresses up to look cool but then just sits there and doesn't talk to anyone but his close friends-kinda guys. Not that I'm proud of that... it's just how I've rolled in the past.
But, it's obvious that my girl would love it were I to start dancing with her. And, I'll concede... we would make a really cute team.
My hold up is... there's really no way I would consider dancing without the motivation of her increasing disappointment and longing. I mean, I think dancing is cool, and I love watching youtube clips of it and stuff, but it's just not really something you can do casually and be competent at. (this assumption btw is borne of reading from this message board and listening to some of the podcasts and hearing my girl and her friends talk about it) And, certainly part of my hang-up is that I hate doing stuff I'm not good at when the learning, and foolish-looking, and mistake-making has to take place in a public setting... touching sweaty people even!
Also, honestly... I don't think I'm ready to be assimilated into a new "community". I'm already spread a little thin as it is across a bunch of other pursuits... so, it feels overwhelming to dive into this scene (lifestyle?) knowing that it'll take a huge investment for me to feel confident.
Of course, another thing is that because I'd really only be participating for the sake of this singular, adorable girl... I'm not really stoked to dance with anybody else... like, the social dancing stuff (which, I understand is how you hone your skills).
Sometimes I'm just like, "f*ck it... I'll just go to the beginners class and start trying to figure this out... it'll be fun... I'll learn something new, and maybe this'll be good to make me more sociable"... but then the other half of the time I think, "ugh. this sucks. Maybe it's cool that dancing is just her thing. I'm not jealous that she's out doing her thing twice a week...I'm glad she has that... and it might actually be better for me to stay aloof from that whole deal..."
I dunno. This has got to be super annoying to read... so, I deserve whatever snark you want to toss this way... or, if you're feeling generous, feel free to illuminate my world somehow.
It just sucks when you date a dancer 'cause it feels like you have to align yourself on one side or the other.... you're either a pro-dance, affable participator... or, you're a surly, un-cooperative, fun-hating, non-dancer.
And, for the record... as with other things I've focused my passions on... I know I could be a good dancer... I have good rhythm and co-ordination and stuff. But, y'know... I also want to be authentic, and I don't know if it's authentic to start on this path only so I can dance with my girl every now and then and make her happy.
thank you good people.
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Um no. There's nothing wrong with having different hobbies, and it doesn't seem like this is one that you want to pursue right now.
Of course, you could just try it...just because we all want to dance with you.
Dating a dancer... that does put you in a somewhat awkward position. My biggest thought is that if you don't dance, will you get jealous? She will be wrapping her arms around other men several nights a week, and if you don't know the dance scene, that can easily be misinterpretted.
I do want to point out that dancing is not nearly as difficult to learn as you seemtothink, especially if you are using podcasts and Yehoodi as a reference. I would encourage you to take a lesson or two and try going out, at least to see what the scene is like with your own eyes, and meet some of your GF's dance buddies.
First off welcome! This should be an interesting discussion.
I'll make some overarching generalizations that are mostly true. MOST people who really LOVE a social hobby ultimately wants to be with someone who they can share that hobby with sometimes. That doesn't mean that they want to do every hobby that their partner does all the time, just that every once in a while it's nice to do something you love with the person you love. At some point you may force her to choose between you or dancing and one will lose. Factor in that she's meeting new guys twice a week and those odds just got slightly worse for you.
Competent - sure you can. The learning curve at the beginning though can be steep at times, absolutely, and you'll have to put some time and energy in. Once you have it you can be quite casual, learn how to use a few moves in lots of different ways for three minutes, then make your way over to the bar with the other snappy dressers who will welcome you with open arms.
Dancing with only your date is not the best thing socially - but I think most guys who start dancing because of a girl get over that when they become more confident with their dancing and see her dance with everyone in the room. I'd suggest putting the money into privates - you'll be fast tracked and won't have to worry as much about the social aspects until you're comfortable.
Sounds like to me you'd like to be a lounger - which is a good place to be IMO. Dance a few selective songs a night, hang out near the bar with a small group of similarly dressed and mannered people, really listen to and enjoy the music regardless of the danceableness of each tune. Truthfully, it's a great life. I go back and forth depending on my mood and event.
Do you know how awkward it is to have a political argument with a naked man?
My first response when I saw the title of this thread was, "No, learn dancing for all the other girls you might ever date in your life."
I say take a beginner class and find out for yourself if you really like it. If you take the class with your girlfriend, it'll be a great way to spend some time together and show her you care and are interested in her interests. Or you could take it secretly, then surprise her with a spin on the dancefloor.
Let's say your significant other (or you) was into baseball or horse-riding or crocheting that they spent a couple of nights a week on. That's cool - everyone's got different interests. There's no reason why dancing shouldn't be any different. I know many people who's partner (even some who are married) doesn't dance and who are pretty keen dancers.
That being said though, it's a fun, enjoyable and social activity, you obviously don't need to impress this woman. And if you do take the plunge it will be awkward and you'll be shy and meeting new people etc. But you can get to the other side. The flip side is that there are many couples who do dance and it's a great activity to do with your partner.
There are ways that you could "test the water" so to speak. Head out to dance gigs with live bands and prop up the bar - meet a couple of the people and spend some time with your girl when she's not cutting a rug. Try out a couple of drop-in beginner lessons - everyone is in the same boat as you so that should help.
And at the end of the day if it's not your thing, it's not your thing and if this woman is the sort that you would want to be with then she'll respect that and the two of you will find other things to do together.
Hope that makes some kind of sense. :D
I started dancing for a girl. She no longer dances, I still do.
So, you never know. Give it a try. If you absolutely hate it after a few classes and going out, then you know. But until you do it, you can't really say anything.
That said, it's fine for couples to have different interests as long as they support each other in their respective passions, and maintain enough balance in their relationship doing stuff they like to do together.
Why It Took Me 13 Years to Learn the Big Apple • My hiphop crew Freeplay performing at the Dance-a-Rama (video).
The way I see it is what do you have to lose? Give it a try!!! Life is too darn short not to!
The worse that will happen is you won't like it and will decide not to stick with dancing. . .even in that instance your gal will be thrilled you gave it a go!
I have a lot of different, and sometimes conflicting, thoughts on this.
This happens a lot. You would be shocked to find out just how many guys started dancing for a girl. And how many of the girls stopped dancing while the guy kept going.
So you never know! You may really get into it.
That being said, I have a couple of unmentioned cons for you:
I was once dumped by someone because he felt pressured to dance when he really didn't want to. The reality is, if he had talked to me about it, I would have been completely fine with it.
Dating a guy who's just learning to dance is hard. It's tough to be patient and to avoid criticism, and couples actually tend to do much better (with their attitude toward each other and the dance, not just improvement of skills) when they dance mainly with other people. Also, some girls who've really come to understand and appreciate good dancing can be turned off by a guy who dances poorly.
We've had this discussion on the board many times, but from the opposite perspective ("could you date a non-dancer"). I'm currently of the mindset that I'd rather date a really good dancer or someone who doesn't dance at all. No in between. No non-dancers who would like to learn. Everyone, however, has a different answer to your question, and in order to figure out your particular situation, you will have to find out what your girl's answer is (and then whether she is worth it to you).
Here's my advice based on the limited information I have about your situation...
By the way, I'm another one of those people who hates doing things in public until she's good at them. Somehow, I got over that feeling pretty quickly when I started swing dancing. There's something about it...
I don't know that this is part of the problem but fear of dancing ranks second on many lists next to only fear of public speaking. Can you believe that most people are more scared to dance than they are to die? Nevertheless, it would be understandable to be a little fearful of an activity that is so foreign. Partnered dancing used to be a much larger part of the public consciousness and consequently I would assume less feared. I think part of the reason is because dances are where people met their significant other. That said it would not be inauthentic at all for you to learn to dance for a girl. In fact, it would be very genuine. People come to dance for many reasons and stay for many different reasons as well. And you never know...that competitive drive that you appear to have might spur you later to dance for yourself.
Of course, you don't have to share every hobby together. At least for me dance is such a large part of my life that if I were dating a nondancer, then I would want them to participate in any way they could. If you haven't already, you could talk to her and gauge what her expectations and even more so what her wishes are.
What are the dance venues like where she dances? Are they bars where nondancers can have a drink and relax? If they are dance studios it might feel awkward to sit and watch, but then again it would also feel awkward to dance for the first time. Perhaps it might be easier to feel at ease if the two of you went to a venue that had nondancers as well. Let us know how it turns out.
Honestly- a good portion of dancers started dancing because they had a crush on a dancer or because they were dating a dancer.
I am kind of in the reverse position as you; my boyfriend isn't really so much into the dance thing. I've taught him, taken him to camps and dances, and he is freakin' crazy natural at it, but he doesn't want to do anything in public that he isn't awesome at, and ends up getting more stressed about dancing that enjoying it.
So, we have both tried to get him into dancing, and so far it hasn't taken, and that is fine. It is perfectly fine to have different interests, and he doesn't have to swing dance for me to love him. However-and there is a bit of the flip side- I do love dancing with him. I don't care that he is a beginner, that he makes mistakes while dancing. It is simply a joy to be able to share this with him, at any level, because it really is a way of communicating that is important in my life, and a really great way to connect. No matter if he sucks or becomes the best in the world.
I think the point we are at now is just that- he knows what he knows, and it isn't something he is going to pursue. But it is something that we can do together in our house, if we want, or at 2 am in a restaurant on the top of the Alps, to no music, after a few shots of grappa (haha... this happened about 5 days ago!).
So basically my advice comes down to this: You don't need to become a dancer. However, it would probably mean a lot to her (and potentially to you, as well) if you tried, just a little. You don't even need to become competent, just barely functional. That way you can dance around in your kitchen with her, or something, but don't need to go out dancing, unless you want to. And, like others have said, you might find that you really like it a lot more than you expected :D
follow my adventures at www.AppalachianToAlpine.blogspot.com!
Before I met a girl who was a dancer, I would never have considered taking classes or attending a dance. But, I took a class while she was away on business, just to please her. The girl is long gone now, but dancing was the surprise of my life in how much I loved it from day one. I never expected that. I'm glad that I did it, whether or not it was for her, but she was the motivation. Maybe you'll have a similar experience, but if not what have you lost?
Do it do it do it do it do it.
8)
"Of course, another thing is that because I'd really only be participating for the sake of this singular, adorable girl... I'm not really stoked to dance with anybody else... like, the social dancing stuff (which, I understand is how you hone your skills). "
For most of my dancer friends, dance is also where we experience a social outlet during the week. I don't care if they guy I date is a dancer or non-dancer--he just needs to be able to mingle and make his own fun if he comes out while I'm dancing. I need to dance and connect in the community I've been a part of for over a decade. If you intend to use dances as a place to monopolize your partner, that likely won't work for most swing dancers.
What board have you been reading?
That being said, sounds like there is actually some good advice and food for thought. In summary, give it a shot and see how it works for you. But don't keep it up if it doesn't really speak to you.
And there is also nothing wrong with learning enough to be able to have fun going out and dancing. You don't have to be like super great at it. There are plenty of people who are socially entwined in the dance community, who don't take it all that seriously as a craft. It's okay to know how to do the basics and have fun for a few minutes when you go out with your GF. Just don't expect her to dance with you all night. As long as there is a bar, you will generally be fine ;-)
Consider doing it just to get over your fear of not looking cool; to challenge yourself.
Consider that having some idea how to dance is a valuable life skill that is far better learned with a competent partner, and that your girlfriend represents a ready-made practice partner. Seriously, if you would ever think you ever might want to learn, now would be your best opportunity. The girl might one day be long gone. The skill will remain.
Consider making it less black n white. You don't have to go all in and become a dancer. You could just try it out. Have you ever just asked her to show you some stuff? Or gone just to watch?
Follows who don't want to get wet shouldn't dance with me.
If you like swing music it is worth pursuing.
This creates a bad dynamic to start off with IMO for everyone.
Do you know how awkward it is to have a political argument with a naked man?
You might like it, you might not. You might like it enough to invest more time and effort into getting good and looking really cool doing it.
But you won't know unless you try ...
Also, if you learned to dance, even if you didn't dance the whole night with your girl (because chances are, she's there to social dance, not just dance with you), at least you'd be in the same space as her, hanging with her friends (who might become your friends) etc. If that's important to you, then come on and dance. If it's not, that's cool.
Just because you learn to dance doesn't mean you always have to dance ... so you don't lose anything.
(Lee Ann Womack)
"Change your thoughts, and you change your world" - Norman Vincent Peale.
As others have said I think we all have a different idea of what we want from the dance. So I certainly don't speak for us all but since you asked for opinions...here is mine...
I would hate it if a guy started dancing only for me. I wouldn't want to be obligated to spend half my night dancing with him. And god forbid he is a bad dancer then I would feel obligated to dance with him anyway since he did it just for me. (it would be another story if he was doing it for himself...then I wouldn't feel such a huge obligation)Then I would start to feel like he was invading my life because I would no longer have time away from him. I would probably start resenting him for wrecking "my thing" and dump him so I wouldn't have to dance with him anymore. I am actually getting hives right now thinking about it.
and yes, I realize that I am a cantankerous, commitment-phobic bitch and I am completely comfortable with that.
You said that it is "obvious" that she'd like it if you danced with her. Has she ever blatantly said that of is it just an assumption? I once had a guy that I dated for a short period decide that he wanted to dance with me. It forced me into a position where I had to introduce him to my friends and I wasn't really ready for that. Then he couldn't understand why I still needed to dance with other guys now that I had him. If I brought every person that I dated for a month or two dancing the New York scene would have a lot more leads (and maybe a few more follows) but I would probably have to move to another country so that I could dance in peace. (aside from being a bitch...i am also kind of a tramp and I am completely comfortable with that as well)
So...if it really is about HER...then make sure it is what SHE wants. Even though I think dancing for her is not such a hot idea, I do think you should dance for you because it is rad.
This is why we love the redjenn. ;-)
My random thoughts on the subject.
Dance because you want to and in a way you want to.
Taking a few beginner lessons for her sake is cool. At the very least you will gain a slightly better appreciation of all that goes into her dancing.
But if you stick with it, stick with it because you want to. If you aren't having fun, the person you are dancing with probably won't be having fun either.
Some general tips that may be of some use. Not all teachers or dance venues are the same. If possible find a teacher who dances in a way you like and learn from them. Different people show up to different venues, while learning find a venue that has people you are more comfortable with. Realize that neither of these choices may be the same ones that your significant other would make.
And don't worry too much about being swallowed by the scene or being pegged as "pro-dance, affable participator... or, a surly, un-cooperative, fun-hating, non-dancer". Theres room for in between.
I've been a misanthropic, angst-y, doesn't talk to anyone but his close friends kind of dancer for years. The number of people I love dancing with on a given night is much larger than the number of dancers I have had substantive conversations with and much much larger than the number of dancers I would actually be comfortable hanging out with.
I wish I had an easy answer for you. Or could lend you my abilities for a while.
It sounds like you have a great grasp of the situation and the dynamics in play. So, I think you'll do well whatever you decide. But over the years I've seen a lot of these mixed relationships have problems - usually from jealousy, time and other personal issues.
I suggest you try to open yourself to dancing with other people as much as possible (otherwise you might be hanging around at events twiddling your thumbs and leads are pretty much always in demand). It is not necessarily a romantic thing and there's lots of benefits.
Of course, I should listen to my own advice, as I still spend much of my time watching!
See you guys at Fram tonight.
I voted and was pleased to see everyone encouraging this guy to jump in.
I've been a big evangelist over the years and I don't know anyone who has had regrets. A majority of people drop out though, but they certainly remember that they've... (cue music) HAD THE TIME OF THEIR LIVES.
(I have no cartilage)
mmmm.... these are some great perspectives... lots to think about... thanks everyone... I appreciate your thoughtfulness. I need to digest it all a little more and I'll be back a little later with more detail/thoughts.
Dude, that's all of us, minus the skateboarding.
"Chaw, chi-chaw, chi-chaw." - Lindsay Bluth
Do you drink? Because if you do, then you could still totally fit in her scene without dancing. You're just the guy in vintage clothes, holding a cocktail, and too cool to dance. :P
I actually know of lots of folks who date dancers, who hang out with dancers, but don't really dance. Dancing is only a little different from any other hobby in that it basically requires socializing with the opposite sex.
If you do learn to dance, make sure you can handle some criticism from your girl. If you don't, make sure you don't get jealous of her activities involving other guys. Either way, these are things that a guy has to get past to even have a decent relationship.
Consider learning a dance together that she does not know. Bear in mind that she will still be better than you and learn faster.
Foxtrot can be danced to a lot of swing music. Or you can go out in left field with one of the latin dances such as Salsa. ( I know it's Ballroom, but that might be a good place to start.)
I think if you like the music and the era and the dance looks interesting try it...can't hurt.
If you decide you do like it don't go out expecting her to spend all her time with you. That is a lot of pressure. Best to get lessons from people other then her because my experience is this can cause lots of pressure in a relationship.
If you decide you don't want to dance but you want to stay with her you need to not be jealous.
Personally I am married to a non-dancer. We dated for 4 years before getting married. Dancing is definitly a less focused part of my life then it was but it is still there. He trusts me to use good judgement while out dancing and I have never pressured him to learn. Before my husband I dated a dancer and that for me personally was a lot more stress.
It is not wrong for you to try it because someone you like does it. Who knows, maybe you'll like it. If you don't like it, at least you'll have learned something about what she does. And if she really does want you to try it, she'll appreciate the effort.
But do make sure you talk to her about it first. So you both understand what expectations really are.
If she wants you to dance with her, it is probably because she wants to dance with you, and not because she needs you to be good at it. And unless you turn out to have her level of interest, she'll always be better than you at it. But that will only work if you're both okay with being at different skill levels. It's a good idea to think about it in advance, whether this will be an issue, and to continue to discuss later in case either of your feelings change. If you want to be more casual about it, and she's happy to dance with you at a low skill level, then great. But if that feels crappy to either of you, and you don't become obsessed, then there should come a time when you give up the idea of dancing together.
It will also be important to her that she doesn't feel obligated to entertain you all the time when you go with her to dances. If you're fine dressing for a dance, listening to the music, talking to people, and not dancing much, then she'll be fine too. But if she feels like she has to spend all her time with you, rather than dancing with her favorite partners, out of concern that you'll be bored, she won't look forward to dancing with you.
Keep in mind, though, that my advice is colored by my experience, and yours may be different.
My husband and I actually started dancing together. He really only did it because he knew I wanted to. He likes the music, but he isn't interested in dancing, and he was relieved when I saw that and told him not to keep it up if he didn't enjoy it. But I do appreciate that he made the effort to try it, and it would probably bug me if he'd never been willing to give it a try.
I love it when he comes to a dance on occasion, but I especially likes it when he brings his camera so that he'll have something to keep him entertained while I dance with other people. I wish he'd dance with me once in a while, but he rarely does because he's self conscious about me being better at it than he is. I'm perfectly fine with dancing with someone at his level (he has a really nice feel, actually), but I can tell it makes him uncomfortable, so I try not to push it. It's just not fun when he's uncomfortable with it. Mostly, I go dancing when I want to, and he goes out for photo shoots when he wants to, and we coordinate so someone's always around to watch the kids. And it works just fine.
-- Rachel
I know a couple. The girl dances. The guy doesn't. But the guy is way popular in the dance scene, as he comes out with her when she dances and he just socializes with everyone at the dance. Everyone knows he's not into dancing, but he's a cool guy and is great fun to chat with. You can always consider this approach.
You can also show your support by trying a hand at DJing swing music, if you dig the music and like to collect it. Alternatively, if your girl is all about supporting a particular dance venue, ask about volunteering to collect admission at that venue. You'll socialize with lots of people, support her and the dancing, without actually having to worry about dancing.
Just a suggestion.
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